Crushing It In Construction

#77 Hit The Ground Running! Co-Founding A Business To Semi-Retirement In Nine Years With Guy Schweitzer

• Jordan Skinner

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Welcome back to the Crushing It In Construction Podcast.

In the hot seat this week is Guy Schweitzer, one of the founding directors of MGN Civil in New South Wales.

Now a national company taking on projects from east to west, MGN have grown rapidly since forming in 2015 - as Guy reveals, it really has been an unstoppable journey.

He shares how some old-fashioned interpersonal skills landed them an early client who sorted them out with all the necessary accreditation, and how this pivotal job set them on their upward journey.

Plenty to gain from this chat, as Guy reflects on a whirlwind few years and enjoys the perks of semi-retirement now that the infrastructure is in place.

He even managed to run across the width of Australia... it took him 78 days!

CONTACT DETAILS

Guy Schweitzer
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/guy-schweitzer-87409738
Website: https://mgncivil.com.au/

Jordan Skinner
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordan-skinner-685439178/
Website: https://moonshotmedia.com.au/

Want to book a FREE 30-minute consultation call? Book a time to speak here: https://calendly.com/book-a-chat-with-jordan/chat-with-jordan

Is your company attractive to potential employees? Take the scorecard: https://moonshotmedia.com.au/scorecard

Hello, everybody. Jordan Skinner here back with another episode of the crushing it in construction podcast. A podcast that is dedicated to the construction industry, where I interview amazing guests from within the industry that all share their experience, their wisdom and insights. That'll help you. The listener either grow within your career or grow within your business. So no matter where you are in this industry, there is always something valuable to learn from our guests and their stories. Now this week, I'm chatting with guys Schweitzer from Mgen civil, and we had a really great chat. in the episode we spoke about how the business got going. Um, how he and his two other partners, slid up the responsibilities. You know, those guys were doing everything in the beginning on the tools out on site all day, every day to eventually within the last 12 months, they've, they've really put, like a solid management structure in place that allowed the three directors to step back quite a bit and hand off some of the functional roles to people, just really take a massive step back. So in this episode, we talk about a whole heap of different things. So firstly, we talk about how they went about putting that management structure in place that has allowed them to sort of take a bit of a step. Step back. We also talk about why building and developing relationships is so critical because in MGNs case, It was literally how they got going. They had a client help them put systems in place, build the business up so they could actually get out there and start taking on more work. And without the relationship, they probably wouldn't have been able to a. You know, get going at as easily as what they had. So. We talk about a whole heap of different things in this episode. I think it's going to be a great episode for people that are in the early stages of building a business. there's a lot of key takeaways that I think you're going to find really valuable. So let's get into this week's episode.

Jordan:

guy. Thanks for coming on the podcast, mate. How's your day going?

Guy:

Yeah, so far so good. Just a bit of pricing and, yeah, pretty standard day at the moment.

Jordan:

Yeah. No fires to put out. nothing like that.

Guy:

not for me. Not these days.

Jordan:

that's not your problem anymore.

Guy:

not at the moment anyway.

Jordan:

No, no. Well, so, for everybody that's, having a listen, to us chat, could you just explain to us who you are and what it is you do? Give yourself a bit of an introduction.

Guy:

Yeah. So, yeah, obviously Guy Schweitzer, one of the owners and directors of construction company, MGN Civil. I'm a civil engineer and, we've been running MGN for now for a bit over eight years. but I've been, in the industry effectively since, 1999. So quite some time now and, yeah. vast experience across, both, private and public sectors to this point in time.

Jordan:

how did you actually get into the industry? Did you have family that was mixed up in construction? Like what, what was the link?

Guy:

well, it was kind of just fell into it really. Like, so when I was in high school, I was a bit of a loose kid at school. going into too much details and really I was pretty smart kid, but I was kind of, not very. directed in what I was wanting to do. And, anyway, ultimately, one of my schoolmates, who ended up a year in front of me because I left school and went back and all these kinds of things, he was doing civil engineering, in Newcastle. And I come from Port Macquarie, mid North coast of New South Wales. And, and I said to him, I might get into building and he goes, Oh, come along. Do civil engineering like me, and you can be the boss, you know, when I went right. And, and'cause he had a house to, for me to stay out in Newcastle. That's kind of how I fell into it really. It was totally not expected, but, and wouldn't have decided until I was in year 12.

Jordan:

Yeah. Yeah, I tell you what, it sounds like you and I maybe were a little bit similar at school and I'd like to, like to say, you know, I was one of those kids that was too smart to be there and I was bored because I was, that bright, but it wasn't, it wasn't the case. So it was, I was just deterred. That was plain and simple what it was like. so Did you do anything else before getting into civil engineering? Like, did you have other jobs?

Guy:

yeah, I had a bit of a funny, teenage years which probably actually set me up for my life, but it was, in hindsight, like I must've been hard for my parents, but other than, you know, usual, school jobs that I did, I worked at McDonald's and Franklin's and old supermarket back in the day and various things like that, through high school. And then through university, similar things, you know, just, some weekend jobs at, university. I ended up joining the military, through their program, their, undergraduate program in my second year of uni. So through the second, third and fourth year of uni, was doing secondments to, Air Force bases and things. So, but other than that, once I did all of that, no, it was straight into engineering.

Jordan:

It's interesting. You mentioned McDonald's because I've always heard, I never worked at McDonald's. I worked at, my first job was in a, in an Italian restaurant, but everyone that I've ever spoken to that's worked in McDonald's always came away looking at the business going, wow, they have a system for everything. Is there anything that you remember that still sticks out in terms of like, what you learned there? Was it, was it very system driven?

Guy:

Yeah, very system driven and processes for everything. kind of didn't have to think too much. Like once it was set, you know, you cooked a burger a certain way, even washed up a certain way, made the chips a certain way. And, my wife and I now own a brewery, which is, obviously a hospitality type venue. And she used to work at McDonald's to when she was a kid. And we often refer to things that we Had to do at McDonald's applying it to our, brewery venue now, you know, in terms of staff management. And that was like 30 years ago.

Jordan:

Yeah. so let's fast forward. You know, you finished high school. you're now a civil engineer. Where, where did you first land? what was your first job in the industry as a, as an engineer?

Guy:

so as I said before, I was, it was part of the, Air Force undergraduate program. And so I had a payback period I had to do with the Air Force. And, so my first job. Once I left Newcastle Uni, we went to, my wife and I went to Sydney and I was what they call an airfield engineer. That's what they call civil in the military or certainly in the Air Force. I was based out at Richmond, out near, Western Sydney there. So I was there for a couple of years, and then I spent some time with the army at Randwick and a few other places with the army actually really enjoyed engineering in the army. then when my time came up, told me I needed to do something else. and I left after my. Minimum time

Jordan:

Yep. And then where did you end up after that?

Guy:

up in Brisbane. So we, all my military time was effectively in Sydney. and then, my wife and I, same thing was just like, Oh, where do we want to go? We don't want to live in Sydney. It's too big. And, where can we get. Both get employment and so we chose Brisbane and I, at that point, joined a construction company which no longer exists unfortunately, uh, CivDec Constructions as a junior engineer and, that's how I got into construction.

Jordan:

and so how long were you working in the industry, I suppose, as a, as an employee before MGM was born?

Guy:

MGM started in 2015. So I finished uni, call it 2000. So 15 years

Jordan:

Yeah. so what was it that I suppose gave you the itch to do your own thing? Was it, was it something you thought you always wanted to do at some point or never intended to be that way?

Guy:

now, I guess I'm a pretty ambitious kind of a fellow, but I guess my ambition throughout my, career until MGM was more driven around, wanting to be the general manager, call it CEO, whatever, That was what I saw as the pinnacle at that point in time and so, so eventually I, you know, made it to general manager of the engineering, department at the Port of Brisbane, who'd recently been privatized at that point and I got to that level and All of a sudden I wasn't doing engineering anymore, which was kind of a little bit of an eye opener for me and made me want to rethink what I wanted to do. And, after about three years in the GM role, I, obviously made a lot of relationships over the years with contractors and stuff that have worked for me over the years. But happened to be talking to a couple of who are now my business partners, about me moving on from the port of Brisbane and, one of them made a suggestion Neville and, the NNMGN and, was Easter down on the Gold Coast for breakfast. He invited me and the family down and put a proposal to me and, by the end of that year, we, we created MGM. So it was nev ne never something I had in mind. I'd never look back now,

Jordan:

so do you think if Neville hadn't floated the idea that you would have done something on your own at some point, or do you think you would still be, you know, working for somebody else?

Guy:

so when I got to that point, I was thinking about, like maybe putting myself in a consultancy type role, you know? So that's how I was thinking. I wasn't thinking of going into, construction, so to speak, at that point. so yes, I would've. went on to do something else, outside of, the port of Brisbane, but yeah. When Neville put that proposal to me, it was like, it didn't take me long to think about it, to be honest.

Jordan:

so once you kind of committed and the idea it planted the seed or you floated the idea and you were committed, what, did the process actually look like? I mean, what were the first three sort of main stages that NGN, went through to get into where it is now?

Guy:

Yeah, so, before I get to that, the idea, obviously, I said it happened in Easter 2015, and then we just kind of sat tight waiting for our opportunity. we just didn't start and then just sit around, so, the opportunity came in September that year, and we,

Jordan:

So when, when you say waited for an opportunity, what do you mean? You were waiting for the right kind of job to pop up

Guy:

Correct. Yeah, that's exactly it. so Neville and Michael were already kind of embedded in another company at that point. And so we were waiting for the right opportunity. That happened to come up at the Port of Brisbane, and another little job in Brisbane at the time. So we were kind of obviously sowing the seeds with clients that we've grown relationships with over the years, saying that we're going to set up this company and everything. And then of the clients heard about that. They said, all right, well, if you do that and, will engage you to do this contract or whatever, you know, so, that's how we actually started. So we kind of just didn't start and then sit for six months hoping to win work. We kind of, we were lucky enough that we could negotiate with some of the clients, good clients that we've had and still are to this day, to get us going. So, yeah, so that's how, how it all happened. But then in terms of the three stages, it depends on how you look at it. I guess I look at. the three stages in terms of our input into the business. So at the start, it's probably like a lot of businesses. I suppose. Mick Neville and I did everything, you know, I know I was the tenderer, I was the admin person, I was the Paying the wages and the bills. I was HR person. You know, I did everything on that paperwork size. Mick and Neville were on site. They're kind of, you know, supervisor, skills. and so that early on, it just was. Felt like I, you know, we had no spare time in our lives, you know, and and I'm that's probably a common story in any construction company. Then eventually we got to the point where, can't remember the exact timing of when it happened, but there was like I said, I can't do. This anymore, you know, and, and the boys said, well, we can't manage all these jobs either. And so then we started to employ, I guess I call the second stage is when we let some of those things go to others, you know, and in my case, I, employed another engineer to help me out on projects and also some admin staff to help me with financials and things like that. and we also employed some supervisors, so Mick and Neville had to, didn't have to run all the projects. So that was kind of a soft. way of expanding a little bit. And then, the third stage is probably where we are right now. And, late last year, you know, MGM has kind of turned into a, you know, we're turning over about 50 mil now. So, too hard for us to, be involved in everything. And so now we're effectively way. a separate board of directors, albeit I still do a lot of tendering, and we'll do for the foreseeable future and we now have, interestingly enough, my brother is running the company as our GM. So our company looks very much more, like a corporate business now in terms of our structure, we've got key people in HR, finance, a whole host of supervisors, engineers, a lot different to what it looked like in 2015.

Jordan:

How have you found the process stepping back even further? You know, a lot of people that come into running businesses, they're, mean, I'm, probably bad for it, but you know, they're a bit of a control freak. How have you, felt stepping away from things and giving up some of that control? Do

Guy:

obviously late last year and it was, I actually intended on completely stepping away. So I've been doing most of the pricing work, for the entire life of MGM. And I don't know why I hang onto that, but I really, I look at it and I go, I've been pretty successful. I enjoy doing it and I'll keep on doing it. But I actually intended on letting it go this year. And funnily enough, this year has come around and I've already done three or four tenders already this year. And, and I think On reflection of my comments last year to the group to say I'll step away from that, it was probably a little bit early for me to say that and, now that I'm doing it this year, I can actually probably see myself doing it for the remainder of the year And maybe it's a bit of control, you know, not ready to go. I kind of want to see this transition. Winning work is, one of the key parts of what we do as it is in any construction company. And it's been successful to this point. I'd hate to just see a hard transition and everything just change. Whereas I think if I keep doing this part 12 months, then one, I keep my hand in, you know, what we're pricing and how we're pricing. but also. Transition it for my brother who's running the company, to kind of not change too much if you know what I mean. So

Jordan:

you enjoy that aspect though? Do you enjoy the pricing?

Guy:

I really enjoy it actually.

Jordan:

There's no point giving it up then,

Guy:

no. and it's funny, you know, like it's because effectively you could say a semi retired to some degree and, and it's, You kind of wake up in the morning. This hour was late last year when there was nothing to price. I was like, what am I going to do today? You and this kind of, whilst it feels like I'm part time, which I kind of am, it gives me something work on in addition to some of the other interests that I've now got.

Jordan:

Yeah, and so company's come quite a long way in a, in a pretty short space of time, you know, like, some businesses, don't get anywhere near, mil turnover in the first eight years, let alone semi retire. what I suppose was one of the first key milestones that you guys had in the business that made you think that doing what you've done now is actually possible.

Guy:

Yeah. So, back in 2016, so we were barely, weren't even a year old. there was this project, for New South Wales Public Works in, Bethungra, out near Wagga Wagga in New South Wales, and it was a dam project. And, the company prior. that had won that job, had some arrangements with both Mick and Neville. Oh, certainly Neville anyway. Neville had some connections to it through machinery and things. Anyway, that job went quite bad for that company and ultimately ended up that company falling over, which left Neville in a bit of a bind in terms of, outlay that he had made, and not receiving payment for. We were fortunate that The client there, public works, and in particular, Mr. Guy Russell, who, he's retired now, but, he got talking to us when that job fell over and, you know, and we effectively negotiated. A deal with the New South Wales government to take on that project and effectively do it for the same price that the previous contractor was doing it and move forward. So it was a, it was a, probably in terms of projects, it was the first significant project that we picked up. That was an upgrade to the dam there. And, and secondly, the fact that the client. willing to negotiate with a company that was barely six months old the back of the three of our experiences with the government, which was quite refreshing. but not only that, client also, helped us develop our systems so we could actually do the project, you know? So, we didn't even at that point really have, health and safety and environment systems. Certainly not to a standard to operate for the New South Wales government.

Jordan:

so you didn't have like, well, in NSA, it's like IO 9,000 accreditation, all that sort of stuff. You

Guy:

none of that. No. And we still didn't at that point. And even when we we still didn't have it. We were very crude at that point because, you know, that was my job as well. Another one of my jobs and, uh, and for the New South Wales government to Pretty much help us get the tick in the box to actually do the job. Not only that, but also negotiate to do the job as well. It was like, wow, this is pretty good. We obviously onto something here that, a client's willing to do this for us, effectively get us rolling, you know, and, and in that, in the end, the job ended up being, good little job for us. and we helped them with the design and everything. was just kind of a strange one of those moments where, you win a job without effectively tendering, you get your systems put in place by the client and you actually help them design the job, and in the end financially, it was a good job for us as well. So.

Jordan:

do you think it was that made them kind of put in so much effort with you in the beginning? Cause sometimes I you know, a customer will barely look at you, let alone help you get your business off the ground.

Guy:

Well, It was more to do with Neville than anyone else Mr Guy Russell knew me, but worked previously with Neville and Neville prior to MGM had quite a bit of experience in building seawalls, rock walls, revetments and whatever. And effectively this was a dam project. That's effectively what the job was, was in, fixing up a big rock. buttress on the, on the downstream side of the dam. and so Neville had had a longish relationship with, Public Works, and Crownlands, and they loved his work and were willing to bank on the person rather than the company.

Jordan:

I think that's a huge lesson because one thing I've learned as I've got older is there's just no substitute for actually getting out, shaking hands and talking to people. And it's not, naturally the way. You know, I'm not naturally inclined to do that, but we've had, engineers work for us in the past that have never left their office, you know, that all they do is go on tenders, they say, or, you know, whatever it is, and they just tend to tend to tender, but which is fine. That's their job, but there's still a massive benefit in having a relationship with somebody. I don't care what anybody says.

Guy:

it's 100 percent right. And in this case, at this particular point in time, as I said, there were never was involved in a previous arrangement on that project and previous ones to that. And quite often the client, whilst never wasn't an owner, he was pretty much a, sometimes an unincorporated joint venture partner or just a savvy to that particular construction company. But most people thought he was the owner because he was the face. Of everything, you know, and, what you've just said, it nails it on the head. If you're hiding away in an office all day, you kind of don't get known and therefore you, you don't have those relationships and, and fortunately, Neville, he's not keyboard person. He's not a, texting person. He's either meet your face to face or, on the phone and, and that's really, Okay. Helped us a lot over the years, particularly in those early days.

Jordan:

Yeah, I still remember being, when I was still working for, for the old man, taking on a new engineer. And the first thing you would say to him is say like, it's all good to be great on a computer and send nicely worded emails. That's one piece of the puzzle. You need to get out there. You need to shake people's hands. You need to talk to the client. You need to build some form of relationship because yeah. Okay. Your tender is ultimately what, wins the job at the end of the day. But that relationship still has. a bearing on the decision, even though it shouldn't, does.

Guy:

and it's 100%, like I said, without Neville's involvement, we wouldn't have even been asked to look at that job, you know? So, it was one of the main reasons we got that job.

Jordan:

Yeah. Yeah. And I don't know whether it's, you know, it's my generation, you know, but, uh, I don't know whether that is getting worse, you know, cause I think people are buried nose deep in their phones all the time now that the communication skills needed to build those relationships are diminishing.

Guy:

Yeah, you're probably right. Although I guess young people will be growing up with young people and so the probably clients and contractors will be communicating the same way. I suppose it's where it probably may let some, you know, younger people down is for, the older people like, Neville and, to a lesser extent myself, where some of those forms of communication as sort of a little bit foreign to some of the older guys that are still in the game, you know,

Jordan:

there's also just so much that can be lost, you know, an email can be interpreted, 50 different ways. And you know, only need somebody to interpret something the wrong way and you've pissed them off and they, you know, you've blown the relationship up even further.

Guy:

lost track of how many times where I read emails and I go, man, he's angry, you know, and then, but when you catch up with him and your eyeball on him, you think, I should have just met him in the first place. You know, it's just the time the email time can be totally misconstrued. all of a sudden, before you know it, you've got a keyboard war going on, you know, and, and I'm one one sit down for coffee or something might have resolved it. You know,

Jordan:

yeah, for sure. And so, that key moment was obviously one of the springboards to get the business really humming. but it. kind of sounds like, the stars aligned and things were quite easy in that respect for that particular job. But what was winning work like after that? Yeah.

Guy:

like to think we had a really solid purple patch for quite some time. COVID us around a little bit, but generally we, felt like we were on this upward trajectory. And when we were winning, you know, like it was a, it was, you know, when we're winning, we're still winning. But, back then, back then I can still remember how exciting. I, I love nothing more because I was the one that obviously the call from the client or whatever. And, and, letting Mick and Neville know that we'd won another job and, you know, it'd be high fives, going to have some beers and ring the bell. we still ring the bell, but, mate, it was proper. It was a big deal, you know, and it didn't matter whether it was a 50, 000 job or a 5 million job back then, you know, it was super exciting and particularly when you want a new client, and it's not to say it's not as exciting anymore. certainly is, but I think when you're growing, and you feel like you're, on this trajectory. It was like it was like proper. I don't know. It was like a drug. Almost, you know,

Jordan:

yeah, yeah. And so, I mean, like you've made it sound easy so far. Was there ever a point where guys kind of thought, Oh shit, wait, what have we done? can't have all been smooth sailing.

Guy:

you know, up until covered, I would say it was just one went after the other after the other. Never felt like we were struggling, you know, like, and our financial records and number of jobs prior from 15 to whenever COVID was 20 or whatever, was just up, up, it was just kept stepping up, you know, and then COVID hit and slowed us right down. and we had a couple of main years, Those times, not necessarily all because of COVID, but, you know, we had a bad job as well. but, since then it's been boom again, you know, it was like a, just this, like a leveling, um, but ultimately in terms of, you know, if we ever thought as a business, I don't think we've ever, the three of us have ever gone, sat down and gone, why are we doing this? Quite the opposite. Actually, it ultimately was a life changer for all three of us. But, you know, me personally, I've had that moment. When we ventured west and so we're effectively a Queensland company, but, and operate in New South Wales and Queensland, every job we've done other than the stuff we're doing in Port Edlund has been in Queensland, New South Wales. we run this, big project over in WA in Port Edlund, the Sporebank Marina. And it was so big for our company that we figured the owners should be involved, even though we had guys that could go over. And, so, For the first time for me, I put my hand up and said, Oh, I tended it. I'll go and run this job. and Neville came over and helped me get it started. but it was a, you know, it's a long term commitment. I was over there for, two years or something like that. And, then I got stuck because of COVID. And so I had moments there when, you know, couldn't get home. and, just, you isolated and all of that. And there was moments where I personally was like, you know, is it worth it? You know,

Jordan:

Could have been worse though. You could have been doing that for somebody else. At least you were doing it for

Guy:

Well, and in hindsight, you know, ultimately, going to the West, has set us up for where we are today. You know, really, mean, everything had its part to play, but, taking us to that next level was was Western Australia. And, yeah,

Jordan:

how much do you think having partners played a role in how you handled the setback of COVID? Cause not to be rude, but like, somebody starting a business that's going well, that really hasn't got, hasn't been in business for 25 or 30 years beforehand, hasn't seen the cycles that most businesses go through. So if you were on your own, do you think you would have had a different mentality when COVID hit, whereas, you know, I'm assuming if you've gotten partners, you've got a few other people there to be like, no, look, we just need to weather the storm. We need to do X, Y, and Z. You've, you've got those partners to kind of help, You know, 20 or 30 years experience running a business that somebody else may have.

Guy:

yeah, you're 100 percent right. I know. mean, obviously my Resilience to pitfalls and, ups and downs has obviously like anyone. It grows over time and back at covert. I remember I was pretty stressed. You know, we made, we made a conscious decision not to let anyone go. And so we knew we were going to take a hit, you know, and, we didn't let a single person go, even when we didn't have work for him. we just kept them on and, I'm glad we did because, and, and the logic we did there, there was a couple of reasons, one personal for the people, you know, they've been good for us for all that time. And, we didn't want to affect them and their families, but ultimately, and I'll use, I talk about Neville a lot. He's the wise head in us. He's a lot older than me. He's the next generation above me. And this helps answer the question in the sense that he. Says we need to be ready to hit the ground running because COVID is going to end and we want to have people in place that when the jobs pop, we can go, you know, and we're gonna have experienced team, not just scrambling to put resources together. and fortunately for us, and, Neville was a bit of a level head for me personally, but Neville had has seen the ups and downs of. been almost broke at times, you know, in his earlier life. and so his view was all these things come to an end, you know, and so he would, he would I guess, talk to Mick and I and make us, just write it out and things will come good again, you know, and, lo and behold, it did so,

Jordan:

Yeah, for sure. I'm curious to know your thoughts on something. I got an email the other day, and I think I've seen a post on LinkedIn of, I was not talking to somebody the other day. I can't remember, but they're talking about the impacts of AI. So chat GPT, all this sort of stuff on engineers. you And there's other industries that have been impacted by it already. You know, you've got, uh, designers and developers, all these sorts of things that are really worried about what the future of their profession looks like. And I've just noticed that it's popping up in my LinkedIn feed about engineers. What's, what's your view there? Hmm.

Guy:

I'm not a very tech savvy kind of a person. I used to think I was pretty good at it until my son came along and makes me look pretty ordinary on the computer and he's right into AI and all that kind of stuff. But I've not personally used it. and that's probably a fear thing with it. But, I do know my brother has dabbled with it, but more just for basic things like checking grammar in documents and, you know, is the document written the way it should be sounding, you know, and beyond that, that's really all I've seen on the engineering side on my other business for the brewery that I can see a lot more different things can happen there. So,

Jordan:

it's interesting because I was listening to a podcast the other day with, the CEO of ChatGPT, and he said, you know, if it replaces hundreds of millions of jobs, if people don't have a purpose, you know, things unravel really quickly. So, you know, what are jobs in the future going to look like all that sort of stuff. And that's why I was listening to it. Cause I'm, I'm interested to see what his views were. And he said, look, if you asked me when we started this, he would have said, AI would have taken away blue collar jobs first, but the further we've come into this, he said, it's going to be the white collar jobs, the knowledge based jobs. That are gone first, which, you know, you were saying this with designers, coders, all the rest of it. but I suppose when you look at it, doctors, lawyers, all these knowledge based things, where they're effectively being paid for their knowledge. don't know.

Guy:

I think you're right there. Like, I guess I haven't given it too much thought, but like my only concern with it and, you know, it's something I've spoken to, I think with my son actually, is, his view is, is those that master AI will be the future, right? And so you may be the smartest engineer, but if you know how to use AI to answer questions and all those kinds of things or, You know, answered medical questions or whatever. It may not be the sharpest tool in the shed, but if you know how to run that system, forget my ignorance on, on how to refer to it. But, you will have a place in the future. You know, and I, I have a few concerns about it. I, you know, I think of university students and think, I think, God, it'd be hard for, um, lecturers and stuff to weed out who's actually smart, smart and, and who's, who's using ai. You know, how do, how do they do?

Jordan:

I would have sent the servers into meltdown trying to get through high school, if it was around when I was there, there, it's like, it's like, you know, and there's going to be other people like that too. So yeah, it's, it's going to be, it's going to be very interesting, but yeah, I just, because I've seen it popping up in my LinkedIn feed, I was just curious to see what your thoughts were, but, um, I've really enjoyed having this chat and. always ask, uh, guests, you know, some of the same questions just so people can get to know'em away from business as such. But what's a weird or interesting fact about yourself that most people won't know?

Guy:

well, it depends on who most people are. people know that I like to run, my friends and family and I, and I ran across Australia last year. So whether that's unknown or otherwise, but that's

Jordan:

Yeah.

Guy:

pretty, unique.

Jordan:

Yeah. So how many, I couldn't believe it. Like my, shin's hurt just here in the words I've ran across Australia. But how many Ks are we talking like.

Guy:

it was 4, 500, by the finish and, I averaged about 64 a day, over 78 days.

Jordan:

what sort of team do you have to have in place to be able to do that? Cause it's obviously not something you've just got on a plane and thought, I'll run home. Like what?

Guy:

run from the reason I'm in the West and finish at home, you know, and ended up finishing it, and had a beer at my brewery. But I ran across the desert effectively straight through the middle and, when I was on my own, I actually a little bike cart that I'd converted into a push cart. And so solo, I was pushing everything, my food, water, camping gear, you name it. so that was about half of it was, was like that. And then, the other half I had people come out and join me. You know, work colleagues that volunteered to come and spend a week with me. and friends and family also come and help me out as well. And it was obviously a lot easier when I got people helping me. I didn't have to push anything, but, um, but yeah, it was, it was a really good experience.

Jordan:

what possessed you to do something like that? Like what, what, what gave you the idea?

Guy:

so, you I'm an ultra runner, so I, I, Got experience in running really long distances like over 300 K's was my previous longest before this, but like a owning a business there's something I'd never really thought of until about 2021 or something like that when I was over in Port Adelaide and a friend of mine Was gonna run across Australia from steep point to Byron Bay and and I remember thinking I wonder if I could do that, you know, and, and, and so that's how the idea spawned as simple as someone else saying they were going to do it. And then I thought, well, I'll do it a little bit different to what everyone else does. Most people try and go from Perth to Sydney or whatever. I thought, well, I might, you know, I'll give it some reason and I'll run from, where I start. I actually started at the work site, and finished with my family at the, at my brewery, which is just down the road from home.

Jordan:

where do you go from here? Like, what, like what's, what's the, what's the next big stretch after that?

Guy:

Yeah, I'm happy that that will be in terms of running. I'm happy that that's my, that it's pretty, pretty unique, but I'm actually currently, running every single street of Brisbane and, and, uh, so there's 13, 900 streets to do and I'm just over 6, 000. So it'll probably take me another year or so and I'll finish that.

Jordan:

I'll have to put a note in my contacts next to your name to remind myself not to reach out to you when I'm in Brisbane for fear of you inviting me to bloody run with you or something stupid. Um, well, like I said, I've really enjoyed having this chat. I appreciate you taking the time to have a chat with me. where can people reach out to learn more about you, learn more about MGM or just, get in touch if they want to learn more about something.

Guy:

Yeah, look, I'm on LinkedIn and MGN's on LinkedIn, Facebook and Insta, we've got a website mgncivil. com. been a bit lax on updating those things in the last couple of years, but we're just starting to get back into that now, so if you follow on you'll see some of the pretty nice projects that we get to do up and down the coast.

Jordan:

Awesome. No worries. Well, thanks very much for your time and, uh, we'll speak to you soon.

Guy:

No worries. Thanks Jordan.